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9-11 Retrospection
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microbehunter
microbehunter
626 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

Unrelated and purely a coincidence of dates: 9-11 marks the 38th anniversary of the 1973 Pinochet coup in Chile. Thousands of Santiago civilians scanning noticeboards looking for the names of the missing, asking passerby's if loved ones had been seen. Scenes very reminiscent of Manhattan civilians in the aftermath 10 years ago...

Sep 11, 2011, 14:57


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lereostab
lereostab
984 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

My post stated what thoughts I had on the day, nothing more....

Sep 11, 2011, 15:42


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Dara
Dara
905 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

lereostab wrote:
My post stated what thoughts I had on the day, nothing more....


...so don't you have any thoughts now then?

Sep 11, 2011, 15:44


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GaryB2
GaryB2
2329 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

Of course not.

I'm getting at the reason for the attack. Namely, Americas support of Israel. This is the single biggest reason spouted by the fanatics for their 'retaliation'. It's crazy of course.

Sep 11, 2011, 16:42


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GaryB2
GaryB2
2329 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

For the avoidance of any doubts you may have I hate all terrorists and their supporters. I do not think that 9/11 was justified and I have expressed my sadness about that day many times on the forum.

The dude in the record shop needs a good slapping in my book.

I'm trying to spark up a debate on the terrorists motivations for 9/11. They didn't do it for a laugh. Why do you think they did it? "Grow a pair" and tell us your thoughts. :)

Sep 11, 2011, 17:01


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Dara
Dara
905 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

lereostab wrote:
When you say "we know who did it" who are you refering to?
I don't think it's possible to say with absolute certainty who did it no matter how many times you watched it on television...



Ok - so you are one of those who believe the idiotic conspiracy theories. You no doubt also believe the world was literally created in six days, that the Apollo lunar missions were staged in a film studio in area 51 and aliens built the Pyramids.

But in this case there are so many contradictions in the belief that the CIA or C&A or Elvis or whoever were responsible for 9/11 that Occam's razor seems to have been honed especially for it. To suggest that the CIA did it, or Mossad or Bush himself in order to justify attacking Afghanistan and Iraq is ridiculous when you consider the fact that anti-Americans accused the US (and the UK) of acting illegally in both wars anyway.

Why would the US kill 3,000 of their own citizens to justify two wars in the middle east. Surely it was easier to just attack Afghanistan and Iraq with no UN mandate, no overall coalition support and with the opprobrium of the entire world and stick two fingers up - which is what the anti-Americans and anarchists accused them of doing anyway.

If these conspiracies were not so insulting and hurtful to the victims of these atrocities and bloody annoying in their block headed stupidity, they would be faintly amusing.

Sep 11, 2011, 17:11


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Dara
Dara
905 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

GaryB2 wrote:
"Grow a pair" and tell us your thoughts. :)


(00) (bollocks being strapped on)

The definitive justification for the attacks on American interests around the world as quoted by Osama Bin Laden in a television interview in 2003 was that 'the great satan' must leave muslim soil in Saudi Arabia, and it was in this interview that he declared a fatwa (holy war) against the USA. That is the simple fact and the only Al-Qaeda motivation for the attacks both leading up to, including and after 9/11.

The discussion is then about why were America on Saudi soil (they were invited there by the Saudis as protection from Saddam during and after the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait), what are the wider aims of islamic fundamentalism and what would happen if we all in the west rolled over and did nothing in the face of these attacks on our freedom.

Sep 11, 2011, 17:24


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GaryB2
GaryB2
2329 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

It's such a fascinating area. I wonder what went on in bin ladens head. At one time he must've been chummy with America (when he was fighting the Russians in Afghanistan, with American weapons). Something changed in his mind between the 80s and late 90s.

Was it just the presence of the USA in Saudi Arabia? I get the feeling that him and his ilk need a cause of some sort and America was very convenient.

Sep 11, 2011, 17:35


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Dara
Dara
905 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

Dara wrote:
a television interview in 2003


*I meant 1993 (and again in 1996)


The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait under Saddam Hussein on August 2, 1990, put the Saudi kingdom and the House of Saud at risk, with Iraqi forces on the Saudi border and Saddam's appeal to pan-Arabism potentially inciting internal dissent. Bin Laden met with King Fahd, and Saudi Defense Minister Sultan, telling them not to depend on non-Muslim assistance from the United States and others, offering to help defend Saudi Arabia with his mujahideen. Bin Laden's offer was rebuffed, and after the Saudi monarchy invited the deployment of U.S. troops in Saudi territory,[77] Bin Laden publicly denounced Saudi Arabia's dependence on the U.S. military. Bin Laden believed the presence of foreign troops in the "land of the two mosques" (Mecca and Medina) profaned sacred soil. Bin Laden's criticism of the Saudi monarchy led that government to attempt to silence him.

Shortly after Saudi Arabia invited U.S. troops into Saudi Arabia, bin Laden turned his attention to attacks on the West. On November 8, 1990, the FBI raided the New Jersey home of El Sayyid Nosair, an associate of al-Qaeda operative Ali Mohamed, discovering copious evidence of terrorist plots, including plans to blow up New York City skyscrapers. This marked the earliest discovery of al-Qaeda terrorist plans outside of Muslim countries.[78] Nosair was eventually convicted in connection to the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, and later admitted guilt for the murder of Rabbi Meir Kahane in New York on November 5, 1990.

Bin Laden continued to speak publicly against the Saudi government for harboring American troops, for which the Saudis banished him. He went to live in exile in Sudan, in 1992, in a deal brokered by Ali Mohamed.

Sep 11, 2011, 17:44


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Dara
Dara
905 posts

Re: 9-11 Retrospection

GaryB2 wrote:
Was it just the presence of the USA in Saudi Arabia? I get the feeling that him and his ilk need a cause of some sort and America was very convenient.


According to Bin Laden in 1992 - the sole reason was the American (kaffir) presence on sacred muslim soil - particularly at the sacred sites of Medina and Mecca.

There are now much wider issues of course, for example the establishment of the global caliphate, imposition of sharia law in the remaining counties in the east who are not already under sharia, and those in the west, and wiping Israel off the map. The fact remains though that in the words of the leader and founder of Al-Qaeda in 1992 and again in 1996 the reason for the attacks on the USA was their continued presence in Saudi Arabia. It must also be borne in mind that this is a particularly irksome issue for him personally as a Saudi himself.

Sep 11, 2011, 17:56

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